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Dodge Could Offer Two Drastically Different Versions Of Its Next-Gen Muscle Cars!

Dodge Could Offer Two Drastically Different Versions Of Its Next-Gen Muscle Cars!​

Different Powertrains Could Lead To Different Styling Cues...​


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Revealed in August, the Charger Daytona SRT Banshee Concept showed the public the direction Dodge is taking toward an electrified future. The conceptual two-door muscle car is just a preview of what the public can expect once the production car hits the streets in 2024.

 

bill burke

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I can not believe there’s is anyone seriously involved with Dodge in any capacity, that would think that the Banshee is the next generation of the Charger. No way Dodge walks away from the best selling performance four door sedan in tha market, and Dodge is too smart to turn the sedan into an all electric only offering. Really guys, the next generation Charger and Challenger will be based on the STLA Large platform that is, hold on now, designed to accept gas engines. A whole new transmission is in the wings to afford a Hurricane/ hybrid vehicle and the Hurricanes will be the lifeblood of Dodge Muscle for at least a decade or more.
You can bet these performance twins will indeed be very close to current designs but greatly updated in and out and be as outrageous as always. I am sure that RWD/AWD will be the formula and they will be lighter and use special suspension systems that make them very tight in every driving setting. Yes a Drag Pack too.
Will there be a Banshee as promised ? Don’t be silly, of course and it will be the only all electric offered, and designed uniquely so therefore we see it as a fastback coupe, with all wheel drive. Never being a Challenger, maybe not a Charger, but a Banshee. We will see.
 
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Shmigga

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Doa to me if it's electric. Not too interested in the I6 either but I'll wait until there is more real life experience with it.
 

James.A

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I can not believe there’s is anyone seriously involved with Dodge in any capacity, that would think that the Banshee is the next generation of the Charger. No way Dodge walks away from the best selling performance four door sedan in tha market, and Dodge is too smart to turn the sedan into an all electric only offering. Really guys, the next generation Charger and Challenger will be based on the STLA Large platform that is, hold on now, designed to accept gas engines. A whole new transmission is in the wings to afford a Hurricane/ hybrid vehicle and the Hurricanes will be the lifeblood of Dodge Muscle for at least a decade or more.
You can bet these performance twins will indeed be very close to current designs but greatly updated in and out and be as outrageous as always. I am sure that RWD/AWD will be the formula and they will be lighter and use special suspension systems that make them very tight in every driving setting. Yes a Drag Pack too.
Will there be a Banshee as promised ? Don’t be silly, of course and it will be the only all electric offered, and designed uniquely so therefore we see it as a fastback coupe, with all wheel drive. Never being a Challenger, maybe not a Charger, but a Banshee. We will see.
I sure hope the ICE cars keep the body of the Banshee. Remove the R-Wing but keep that 68 front end, add rear doors and hatch back. I certainly hope it looks nothing like the current cars. Tired of the bandit nose. Do not like it on the Hornet at all, especially with the DLR's. Could do without the door side scoops too.
 

JohnRogers

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I'm going to hold off on getting hosed by dealership markups. I'll see what this Hurricane 6 is all about. My taste runs HEMI, 340, 360, yadda-yadda but I remember GM fans warming to a black Buick in the 80's.

Mean time I'll pick up a Volare in CA and drive it to FL for my kicks.
 

Deckard Cain

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Since phase out of combustion engines is just for 2035, it makes a lot of sense to make new ICE models that will last until then. That means two more generation of combustion engine Challenger/Chargers.
 

justbekuz1

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Dodge Could Offer Two Drastically Different Versions Of Its Next-Gen Muscle Cars!​

Different Powertrains Could Lead To Different Styling Cues...​


View attachment 7757

Revealed in August, the Charger Daytona SRT Banshee Concept showed the public the direction Dodge is taking toward an electrified future. The conceptual two-door muscle car is just a preview of what the public can expect once the production car hits the streets in 2024.

Hmmm... 2024 aye? Does this mean the new models will meet the asphalt in the Fall of 2023 or the LATE Fall of 2024?
 

TripleT

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Since phase out of combustion engines is just for 2035, it makes a lot of sense to make new ICE models that will last until then. That means two more generation of combustion engine Challenger/Chargers.
punitive taxes start in 2028 in the 14 and 3 pending state who have signed on the California rules.
 

TripleT

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Doa to me if it's electric. Not too interested in the I6 either but I'll wait until there is more real life experience with it.
Why cuz you want to pay more to go slower, be heavier, be less efficient, be more complex, to have less tuning potential, to be less balanced?

For what. to say in has an extra cylinder bank and 2 extra cylinders and louder exhaust. One better look into this engine family before making this statement.

Hemi is being obsoleted by a better engine. And I love my Hemi. But there is no way I am paying more to look at the tail lamps of the new engine series while stopping slower, handling worse, and paying more for fuel. MI here has talked about how it gives tuned Coyote and LS a hard run.

Everything new doesn't stink, though it scaring these are monster engines and hear bullet proof on the dyno.
 
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cygnus

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You are in the minority and the drop in sales will prove it. Owning a V8 Charger/Challenger 2008-2022 was also part - "you're not going to tell me what to drive, and what to buy. To hell with your EVs. I'm going to drive a V8."

You keep discounting the number of people who take that to heart. You are wrong - I am right. Your technical arguments do not matter - sales matter. The punitive fees for the 17 states only matter if the program wasn't able to pay for itself.

The program (with a V8) could have paid for itself, generated profit, even with the fees in those 17 states. Dodge just had to charge more money - I never disagreed that charging more money was the future proof solution. It's the only way forward. But the prices they're charging now for 'limited edition' 2023 MY Charger/Challenge is to cash out all the goodwill (V8s) before completely abandoning the market.

We'll never know how much profit a next generation V8 Charger/Challenger would have generated, because Dodge backed down from selling V8's because of Tavares, and Tim being too weak to push back. Hence the forthcoming I6 lineup.

To back down from selling V8s is weakness. I'll buy a Corvette, Mustang, or Toyota before I buy an non-V8 from STLA.

I guarantee you this next generation offering will flop though, and will barely hit 65% of what the prior generation used to sell in Year 1, 2, n+1 years after intro vs the sales the prior generation had in 2015 after the Mid-Cycle refresh.
 
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Deckard Cain

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punitive taxes start in 2028 in the 14 and 3 pending state who have signed on the California rules.
That doesn't mean it will be unsucessful though. They can sell in the other states that don't follow that. There's still some very big states that don't follow CARB standards.
They might even do something like the Corvette E-Ray AWD Hybrid to drop emissions and guarantee competitive performance.

Also, IMO pure numbers don't tell the whole story. Give me a manual V8 and I'll be very happy, even if it's slower than an auto. Just the growl of the engine and the engagement in driving makes it pay off.
I bet some people would line up for that.
I think that an open mind over this new I6 is needed though. We haven't heard it, know the power numbers it will have, etc. It might quite well be good enough to put the V8 to rest.
 

TripleT

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That doesn't mean it will be unsucessful though. They can sell in the other states that don't follow that. There's still some very big states that don't follow CARB standards.
They might even do something like the Corvette E-Ray AWD Hybrid to drop emissions and guarantee competitive performance.

Also, IMO pure numbers don't tell the whole story. Give me a manual V8 and I'll be very happy, even if it's slower than an auto. Just the growl of the engine and the engagement in driving makes it pay off.
I bet some people would line up for that.
I think that an open mind over this new I6 is needed though. We haven't heard it, know the power numbers it will have, etc. It might quite well be good enough to put the V8 to rest.
My first Car is 64" Plymouth 273 V8 and Hurst 4-spd.... I love it. But no I not pay $40K plus to be slower, I want the best powerplant. If I just want a day to day toy I'd just buy something classic or an Early Challenge.

Personally I think like manuals the take rate is WAY to low to justify the cost, You drop 50 to 75 thousand dollars to have a slower older thirstier likely more expensive powertrain. Nah..... easy to say hard to write the check.

Like I said I have disposable income just to have something purely for show and pleasure it is something from 64' to 71' unless it an Alfa then 75'

This 1674066538778.png
or
THis
1674066625291.png
 
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James.A

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You are in the minority and the drop in sales will prove it. Owning a V8 Charger/Challenger 2008-2022 was also part - "you're not going to tell me what to drive, and what to buy. To hell with your EVs. I'm going to drive a V8."

You keep discounting the number of people who take that to heart. You are wrong - I am right. Your technical arguments do not matter - sales matter. The punitive fees for the 17 states only matter if the program wasn't able to pay for itself.

The program (with a V8) could have paid for itself, generated profit, even with the fees in those 17 states. Dodge just had to charge more money - I never disagreed that charging more money was the future proof solution. It's the only way forward. But the prices they're charging now for 'limited edition' 2023 MY Charger/Challenge is to cash out all the goodwill (V8s) before completely abandoning the market.

We'll never know how much profit a next generation V8 Charger/Challenger would have generated, because Dodge backed down from selling V8's because of Tavares, and Tim being too weak to push back. Hence the forthcoming I6 lineup.

To back down from selling V8s is weakness. I'll buy a Corvette, Mustang, or Toyota before I buy an non-V8 from STLA.

I guarantee you this next generation offering will flop though, and will barely hit 65% of what the prior generation used to sell in Year 1, 2, n+1 years after intro vs the sales the prior generation had in 2015 after the Mid-Cycle refresh.
Agree with a lot of this. I think that If the good looks are reserved for the EV, and the ICE are evolutions of the current boy-racer mullet machine design but no Hemi, the car will flop. The Charger needs to be revolution (like the concept), not evolution. A lot like the 2011-14, this concept has a retro-modern maturity. A new look inside and out may help move the market and fan base away from the current era. Too similar to the current gen style wise but no muscle? It'll be curtains.
 

redriderbob

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Here in Detroit, we don't have a good enough energy grid to support electric vehicles. Most of the people I know don't want EVs and the ones that have them are 50/50 if they would buy them again. There are diehard EVers out there, but until you have an affordable fast-charging grid that is reliable I don't see 50% of sales being BEV in the U.S. If you look at how much it cost to charge a Hummer EV in certain parts of the U.S., its just as expensive to refill my 2019 Ram 1500. With that truck, I don't have range anxiety, if something breaks I can take it anywhere to fix it, and it doesn't pollute any worse than an EV does over its lifetime when all is said and done.

The EV moment is based on the government's decisions around the world. Instead of EVs, we need to be looking at hydrogen. There are more efficient ways to make it now and remember in 1999, all the automakers were looking at hydrogen as the alternative to gasoline.

Do you remember Chrysler's Fuel Cells from the 1990s?

 

cygnus

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Whenever I'm having a bad day I replay the video where they talk about 'unlock crystals' and I can't stop laughing.

I get it, it's to increase manufacturing productivity, reduce build complexity/cost, and opening up future potential revenue by software unlocking more horsepower, post sale, when the buyer is able to afford it.

I'm closer to 40 than I am to 30 and this current state of Fortune 500 business is borderline oligarch capitalism. With ICE, you would have some level of customization/upgrade path that wasn't completely captured/owned by the OEM. With EVs, it's entirely locked down/walled garden. You can't modify anything on an EV, the hardware is bound to the software.

Give me a V8 and lets go back to the late 00s when you used to be able to replace the SSD/memory in a Mac, (before Steve passed away). Now all the memory/disk is now soldered to the board (I've since switched over to a PC desktop (I built) for 90% of my work day, but I do enjoy using my M1 Macbook Pro when traveling)
 

Deckard Cain

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That's not so much an issue of EVs, but of manufacturers trying to squeeze even more profits. BMW and Toyota are doing it on ICE vehicles as well.
When every function gets tied down to the infotainment system, demanding subscriptions for heated seats and steering wheel or remote unlock is much easier.
It's a load of bull, and it's something that is being pushed by consulting companies like BCG, Bain and McKinsey on every company they work with. It worked well for streaming. It also worked well for music. It also worked well for cloud storage so they want to push this wherever they can.

With EVs you still have the customization option of selecting different power and battery levels, and RWD/FWD/AWD. For PCs, it depends on what you buy. You can easily find notebooks that are expandable. Gaming notebooks are quite good in that regard in particular.
 

Shmigga

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Why cuz you want to pay more to go slower, be heavier, be less efficient, be more complex, to have less tuning potential, to be less balanced?

For what. to say in has an extra cylinder bank and 2 extra cylinders and louder exhaust. One better look into this engine family before making this statement.

Hemi is being obsoleted by a better engine. And I love my Hemi. But there is no way I am paying more to look at the tail lamps of the new engine series while stopping slower, handling worse, and paying more for fuel. MI here has talked about how it gives tuned Coyote and LS a hard run.

Everything new doesn't stink, though it scaring these are monster engines and hear bullet proof on the dyno.

Unfortunately you have no real world proof to backup any of what you said which is exactly why I said I would wait to see more real world experience. I highly doubt it will be as reliable as a pushrod v8 though, especially since the engine is brand new.
 

Shmigga

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You are in the minority and the drop in sales will prove it. Owning a V8 Charger/Challenger 2008-2022 was also part - "you're not going to tell me what to drive, and what to buy. To hell with your EVs. I'm going to drive a V8."

You keep discounting the number of people who take that to heart. You are wrong - I am right. Your technical arguments do not matter - sales matter. The punitive fees for the 17 states only matter if the program wasn't able to pay for itself.

The program (with a V8) could have paid for itself, generated profit, even with the fees in those 17 states. Dodge just had to charge more money - I never disagreed that charging more money was the future proof solution. It's the only way forward. But the prices they're charging now for 'limited edition' 2023 MY Charger/Challenge is to cash out all the goodwill (V8s) before completely abandoning the market.

We'll never know how much profit a next generation V8 Charger/Challenger would have generated, because Dodge backed down from selling V8's because of Tavares, and Tim being too weak to push back. Hence the forthcoming I6 lineup.

To back down from selling V8s is weakness. I'll buy a Corvette, Mustang, or Toyota before I buy an non-V8 from STLA.

I guarantee you this next generation offering will flop though, and will barely hit 65% of what the prior generation used to sell in Year 1, 2, n+1 years after intro vs the sales the prior generation had in 2015 after the Mid-Cycle refresh.
I still understand why they think people want a massive two door hatch back based off a 66 Charger. I never thought once about putting a piece of plywood in my Challanger. That is not why I have the car.
 

TripleT

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Unfortunately you have no real world proof to backup any of what you said which is exactly why I said I would wait to see more real world experience. I highly doubt it will be as reliable as a pushrod v8 though, especially since the engine is brand new.
what are you talking about? are you under the impression that real world high hour Dyno test doesn't happen in the physical world? And history has shown beyond that the less complex and smoother straight 6 to be one of the if not the most durable configurations.

The only arguement- one could make is that there may be cyclical issues, implementation issues, or component age related issues that would not show in hours ran but through pure aging process. But the Hurricane line of engine is already well proven in the 4-cylinder version which is innately less balanced.

When people say it has shown to be built proof on the dyno, that a 1500hp version exist.... there is reason to be optimistic.

It one puragative to be sketical but let's not make push rod V-8 out as something that it is not. Simple . its configuration is more complex purely from need of multiple head components and intaking.

Other thing that people need to understand is that the computational power has been exponential, so these powerplants out of the box are superior to the older powerplants. The iteration happens before the first component is cast, then the physical iterations are drastically reduced.
 

Mopar392

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I

Agree with a lot of this. I think that If the good looks are reserved for the EV, and the ICE are evolutions of the current boy-racer mullet machine design but no Hemi, the car will flop. The Charger needs to be revolution (like the concept), not evolution. A lot like the 2011-14, this concept has a retro-modern maturity. A new look inside and out may help move the market and fan base away from the current era. Too similar to the current gen style wise but no muscle? It'll be curtains.

I think they can have the same general look for the EV and ICE cars. Take BMW for example.
 

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