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Dodge Hornet

bill burke

bill burke

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The Dodge Hornet, a spin-off of the just revealed Tonale, looks to adopt much, if not all, of the Tonale’s cutting edge technology and engineering with a Dodge performance interpretation. This is exciting news for Dodge fans. Smartly, the Tonale is taking a European/global approach and Dodge decidedly American, good news again. I predict here and now, the Hornet will be the best selling Dodge in its line up, one that will appeal to performance hungry SUV buyers with Porsche tastes on a lunch pail budget. If Dodge gets this right, the buzz factor will be deafening. Can the “Super Bee” be far behind?
 
They need more powerfull 2.0 ICE and 2.0 PHEV.

The 1.3 PHEV in a Dodge Sporty CUV is unsaleable un NA… as for Alfa Tonale to…

Maybe they should greenlight the Tonale eQuadrifoglio with a 2.0 PHEV option in order to bring it also in the Hornet.
 
I agree. This decision on the Tonale-Hornet linkage is a sound business decision that puts emphasis on performance character. Inevitably there will be other linkages across the Stellantis family, but Dodge and Alfa Romeo is a natural. There was, I suspect, internal resistance that this particular linkage would diminish the AR growth agenda and conflict with that significantly in North America. I also suspect that new thinking at corporate saw things differently and realized that AR would be focused globally and the Dodge would be “Americanized” and it’s spin off would generate huge profits with little harm to AR in North America. The key here is cleverly sharing assets under the skin and making these soul mates very different in styling and perception. Alfa Romeo’s growth plan was conceived by Sergio with a markedly Italian bias and that plan has fallen short to reality and to a new thinking under Carlos. This old protectionist thinking insultingly denied the management at Alfa Romeo and Dodge had the talent to pull this creative linkage thinking off. Hornet, I predict, will prove it can be done at the benefit for both brands. Prediction for Dodge stated above. Best selling Dodge in the lineup.
 
bill burke said:
I agree. This decision on the Tonale-Hornet linkage is a sound business decision that puts emphasis on performance character. Inevitably there will be other linkages across the Stellantis family, but Dodge and Alfa Romeo is a natural. There was, I suspect, internal resistance that this particular linkage would diminish the AR growth agenda and conflict with that significantly in North America. I also suspect that new thinking at corporate saw things differently and realized that AR would be focused globally and the Dodge would be “Americanized” and it’s spin off would generate huge profits with little harm to AR in North America. The key here is cleverly sharing assets under the skin and making these soul mates very different in styling and perception. Alfa Romeo’s growth plan was conceived by Sergio with a markedly Italian bias and that plan has fallen short to reality and to a new thinking under Carlos. This old protectionist thinking insultingly denied the management at Alfa Romeo and Dodge had the talent to pull this creative linkage thinking off. Hornet, I predict, will prove it can be done at the benefit for both brands. Prediction for Dodge stated above. Best selling Dodge in the lineup.
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”old protectionist thinking” what a load of junk and simply not true.
1st this project was done under Manley, and would been out with or without the PSA Merger.
2nd Manley approved this project to improve Italian Output & Capacity, whereas the price point Hornet likely to get wouldn’t make sense to build in North America.
 
bill burke said:
Hornet, I predict, will prove it can be done at the benefit for both brands. Prediction for Dodge stated above. Best selling Dodge in the lineup.
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With the expected « poor » powertrain offer, I don’t think Hornet will beat Challenger and Durango…

I think that it can still sell easily 50k/y in NA.

To be a very « bestseller » it needs a 300+hp petrol engine (the 2.0 FCA engine is capable of that) and a « SRT/Hellcat » 400+hp PHEV high end version.
 
The Hornet seems to be a lazy Tonale rebadge. Like the EV day shape indicated. Different bumpers, lights and hood, but same body. Not good for Alfa in the US. :confused: Spyshot from Pomigliano:

Hornet-1.jpgHornet-2.jpg

Taken from this video: Log into Facebook
 
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New hood and Nose where more than I expected
 
iDrive said:
With the expected « poor » powertrain offer, I don’t think Hornet will beat Challenger and Durango…

I think that it can still sell easily 50k/y in NA.

To be a very « bestseller » it needs a 300+hp petrol engine (the 2.0 FCA engine is capable of that) and a « SRT/Hellcat » 400+hp PHEV high end version.
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They can share Wrangler’s Hurricane options, the eTorque 275hp and the PHEV 375hp.
These are still plenty for its class.
 
Was supposed to be super light. Thats if the frugal french didn't strip the trick parts away. So HP to weight is what one would look at. It shouldn't be thought of as just a straight-line bandit, but overall performer.... either way it going to be tremendous upgrade from the frumpy Journey.
 
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If, and that is a big one, Hornet got an improvement in the dynamics, which I hope Alfa would have improved, then we could have something better than the current benchmark, the Germans.
 
Mopar392 said:
They can share Wrangler’s Hurricane options, the eTorque 275hp and the PHEV 375hp.
These are still plenty for its class.
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Those are longitudinal engines and PHEV systems. Not for the transverse platform of Tonale/Hornet.

The options for transverse engines like Tonale/Hornet are like other models equiped with transverse motor.

The 2.0 270hp of the (small) Cherokee based on FWD transverse platform can be MHEV 48v and there are PHEV « transverse » options like Tonale with up to 120hp more with the e-motor. The Tonale uses a 120hp e-motor with a potential 134hp battery power. So if they want, they can have 120hp of the e-motor.
On the Tonale PHEV 272hp, this e-motori output is currently limited to « only » 94hp ouput.
 
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Horrific thèse pictures of Hornet which seems to be a very little more of a simple rebadge…

Very bad for both brands… At this point it would be better to not sell the Tonale in US…
 
With these photos it seems the more differentiated styling I anticipated is understated somewhat it seems. In describing the obvious potential for overlap and sales stealing in the market I noted the AR plan as being overly ambitious favoring generous Italian product expenditures and discouraging a Dodge linkage as eventually disappointing in reality. The lack of information on my part of Manley green lighting Hornet does not change that opinion much as it obviously is business driven, new thinking and wise. I may be wrong on Hornet being the Dodge sales leader, but this segment is so hot, I can’t see Hornet and its stunning styling, tech rich features and Dodge performance character not generating big sales, but then again I was wrong on Dart that also caught my fancy with premature predictions of massive success. I am captivated, again, at the depth of knowledge, sincerity and enthusiasm that these posts exhibit and hesitate to suggest criticism if others see it differently. My clarifications are given to support everyone’s thinking, especially if it helps both Alfa Romeo and Dodge. Still see a natural linkage here if those in charge can do the differentiation magic right. Big first step with Tonale/Hornet.
 
iDrive said:
Horrific thèse pictures of Hornet which seems to be a very little more of a simple rebadge…

Very bad for both brands… At this point it would be better to not sell the Tonale in US…
Click to expand...

Did someone wake up on the wrong side of the bed? Clearly it not a simple rebadging. That is entirely new front cap and hood. One can assume that if will full rear LED which means an Entirely new Rear cap. So, by definition it is on a simply a rebadge, it is totally restyling and is more than I thought would happen. The reach of ALfa dealership network is EXTREMELY small compared to 2000+ CDJR dealerships. Dodge deserves a version and something that properly replaces the Minivan'ish Journey. Taking advantage of Dodge dealer reach in NA, Alfa global reach to help the ROI on model development is a must. No one outside NA will see the Hornet, Most people in NA are good deal far from Alfa dealership. Alfa needs an entry level vehicle so NO it not bad for either brand.

Now let's talk about performance. This is a LEVEL 2 lightening vehicle Guilia and Stelvio being Level 1. So, it safe to assume given it size that it will be lighter than the Stelvio and at least as light as the Guilia. The Guilia can pull low fives, nearly 4s in 0-60. It safe to say the in the right tune it will be quicker 0-60 than Eagle Charger and in a Quad/SRT configuration or E assist approach or be better than an Apache. So, it can wear both badges proudly.

SO not underpowered and not simply a rebadge, exciting to have a new vehicle in both showrooms.
 
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I was expecting more drastic differences. Especially in the interior. I hope the final product is more differentiated because otherwise there'll obviously exist cannibalization.
PSA clearly knows how to do proper rebadges because the cars of each brand have clearly differentiated character. This? This is lazy. Heck, they could've used the Compass interior as the base instead of the Tonale because it fits Dodge's character a lot more.
 
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