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The future is EV??

patfromigh said:
Guess what, for battery electric vehicles to have a future, new battery chemistries are needed. For new battery chemistries to be possible, there needs to be real world testing. The best way to provide real world testing is with hybrid power trains. This is because hybrids offer more charging and discharging cycles in a given time period.

Hybrid vehicles have smaller battery packs which are more easily serviceable and replaceable. This is another reason engineers want to use hybrids first for the next generation of batteries. ICE bans will burn a bridge to the future before we cross the chasm. Will consumers prefer a pure EV if a plug-in hybrid with a 200 kilometer range is available? Without any government interference, we will probably see 200 kilometer PHEVs on the market before a practical nationwide high speed charging network actually becomes a reality in America. How many municipalities will cheap out and offer level 2 charging stations, as many already have?

The rapid timeline to "zero emissions" being forced by politicians does not match up with the realities of science and engineering. The battery electric panacea is a fantasy. Don't get me wrong on this. Small electric urban vehicles make a great deal of sense. Battery electric commercial vehicles are highly anticipated because they offer a practical efficient solution for many businesses. I highly doubt battery electric 18 wheelers will become popular in a free market, not when CNG and LNG offer a practical near zero alternative to diesel at lower cost.
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NY state just banned Natural gas heating for NY you know including upstate .... people wont be able to heat a new home reasonably.
 
My friend managed to procure a Wrangler 4xe while on a trip this week. He's an old school muscle car/Jeep guy who grimaces and grunts at the mention of doing away with Hemi's and going to smaller turbo or electric anything. That being said, he loves the 4xe. Says it hauls and gets great MPG so far. Wants to trade in his 2020 GC for it but the price tag is a bit too steep. Gotta say something like that in Charger/ Chally might not be bad if the price is right... Imagine an I6 version?... But they'd better not make us wiait until 2025. I'm hoping the production cars debut this summer and order banks open so I can get my R/T order in. I wish I could get a 5.7 but I'll take a S.O. hurricane 6 ASAP.
 
TripleT said:
NY state just banned Natural gas heating for NY you know including upstate .... people wont be able to heat a new home reasonably.
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Go to Wyoming. They want to enact a law to ban the sales of EV's by 2035.(y)😁

Saw a Go Mango SP on showroom floor which was a regular body (Non WB) with adaptive suspension, Dynamic Package, brass gold monkey wheels?-UGLY😱😵‍💫😵😬😲sunroof🤑🤢🤮-I don't want this option as it is just something else to go wrong, carbon fiber interior-YES!👍, best of all it had the "shaker option" but it had the Alpine stereo system👎 not the JBL with 18 speakers.
Anyway Asking was $72,000+ I wanted it even though it had a broken door handle on driver side. (They said that part is on order) The lowest I could get them down was to on this SP shaker car was $67,000🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑
No more cars can be ordered direct from factory. The few allocations they have left coming in from factory are not to my liking or even close to this car on the floor which has been there for quite some time as it was covered in dust inside and out.🤮
I don't know why they don't keep this beautiful car CLEAN n polished since it is inside showroom.🤔
 
VANISHING POINT #1 said:
Go to Wyoming. They want to enact a law to ban the sales of EV's by 2035.(y)😁

Saw a Go Mango SP on showroom floor which was a regular body (Non WB) with adaptive suspension, Dynamic Package, brass gold monkey wheels?-UGLY😱😵‍💫😵😬😲sunroof🤑🤢🤮-I don't want this option as it is just something else to go wrong, carbon fiber interior-YES!👍, best of all it had the "shaker option" but it had the Alpine stereo system👎 not the JBL with 18 speakers.
Anyway Asking was $72,000+ I wanted it even though it had a broken door handle on driver side. (They said that part is on order) The lowest I could get them down was to on this SP shaker car was $67,000🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑
No more cars can be ordered direct from factory. The few allocations they have left coming in from factory are not to my liking or even close to this car on the floor which has been there for quite some time as it was covered in dust inside and out.🤮
I don't know why they don't keep this beautiful car CLEAN n polished since it is inside showroom.🤔
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You can't call oneself a free state and then Ban things either way.... Just as much BS that Wyoming would bad stuff. Leave it to the consumer.
 
One of the most conservative areas in the USA (based on voting preferences) is the Villages in Florida. They arguably have the highest concentration of neighborhood electric vehicles in the country. One would be surprised how many ex-California compliance EVs ended up in places line Wyoming, Montana, and the Dakotas when the snowbirds discovered they make a great dingy behind the RV.

Politicians make lousy engineers. They should not be the ones deciding which technologies should be advancing over others.
 
patfromigh said:
One of the most conservative areas in the USA (based on voting preferences) is the Villages in Florida. They arguably have the highest concentration of neighborhood electric vehicles in the country. One would be surprised how many ex-California compliance EVs ended up in places line Wyoming, Montana, and the Dakotas when the snowbirds discovered they make a great dingy behind the RV.

Politicians make lousy engineers. They should not be the ones deciding which technologies should be advancing over others.
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They also make lousy politicians
 
TripleT said:
Nuclear is the only option.
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China and Russia don't have a problem using carbon based fuels

Western countries want Zero emmisions Modern Nuclear is the only high capacity on demand solutions. Most others are Carbon neutral at best and NOT on demand.
 
TripleT said:
China and Russia don't have a problem using carbon based fuels

Western countries want Zero emmisions Modern Nuclear is the only high capacity on demand solutions. Most others are Carbon neutral at best and NOT on demand.
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China has alot of industry. But here the government just wants to have more control over people and bring up and make "global warming" a big issue when in fact it's a smoke screen for those governments in power to use that term to get more control over the people as well as get more votes from manipulation of the truth. 😵‍💫 👎 The infrastructure here does not support EV's and who wants to sit in their car in public while it's getting charged only to get car jacked/robbed or MUST get a charger installed in their home🤑. If in an apartment the EV driver better hope they have enough charging stations available as well as working charging stations. As many of you already know getting air into your tires is just about impossible now because vandals cut the hose or the gas station will charge you to put air in your tires. It used to be free but now it just depends. That's why you get your own air compressor and do it yourself in the safety of your own garage. But with these charging stations who knows as they have different brands and then there is TESLA. 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥😲😨😵🥴🤢🤮
 
Chinese social credit model is what the USA is copying. They already restrict travel based on their ESG equivalent. They are investing in EV charging everywhere even with street parking. Every garage has charging area. All powered by Coal fire plants.

CARB states don't give a crap, they just mandate EV without a way for people to travel or charge. Its worst than the Chinese as CARB state are basically banning anything but Public Transit.... and see how safe that is when I guy defends himself he ends up in Jail.
 
Privately owned public transit has been just about eliminated in the United States due to government regulation. This started during the New Deal. Our various transit agencies are now wards of the state and are subject to heaviest government control compared to any other nation and this by centralized planners who either don't or rarely use it.

Americans applauded when the privately owned streetcar networks went away. The trolley cars were in the way of our motorcars. Any government big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take it all away. Now it is the privately owned motorcar which will be regulated into what happened to public transit, a state run entity.

The United States has been subjected to ninety years of social engineering under the guise of the "Radiant City" concept. There is no justification for the federal usurping of local zoning laws. The fertile lawns of the suburbs created by government regulation and subsidy provide the growth of social engineering.
 
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Public transportation sucks🤮 as it's unreliable here and more unreliable than an Jag XKE from the 60's.
It's even worse here as you find feces,💩 drugs, needles, crime and can get a diease from the homeless people that ride on these systems.:mad:🤮 It stinks like hell too.🤭😷🥴😵😫
Don't forget too they will steal your Challenger out of the parking lot that you MUST pay a fee🤑 for that is always going up as well as the fares.🤑🤮
 
Government won't force me to drive an EV because by then I will be too old to drive. My gasoline vehicles will get me by till then.
carsaremydrug said:
Governments are forcing us to buy electric cars. And, I need to sell my cars running on gas before buying an EV.
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What will your gasoline cars be worth when this EV situation hits home? If it gets that bad your gasoline vehicles will not be worth anything if there are no gasoline stations or if prices exceed whatever they are charging to power EV's. Also EV's cost more to purchase than a gasoline vehicle at this time. As for the future who can predict that to be accurate enough to prepare for their agenda? I will stick with gasoline for now. When it comes time to buy another vehicle (If I can drive) I will deal with it at the time. But for now while I am driving, I do not find it appealing to wait in line and in public to have to charge my car. Remember when you could get air for free in your tires? This was many years ago. No more as everytime I drove up to an air compressor it was vandalized or cut if they didn't charge you for that air. So I finally bought my own air compressors and no longer go to public air stations. Same thing would apply to these charging stations. I know they will be vandalized or not in operation for whatever reason due to breakdown etc. I don't want to wait in line and get carjacked or robbed. Solution: Perhaps the house will have to be retrofitted with a charger BUT how much $$$ does that cost?🤑🤑🤑🤑 All of the above on EV's do not appeal to me at all. As long as we have gasoline stations, gas powered will be fine by me. I grew up on American V8 cars that got 10 MPG or less and now V8's are just about gone. What more do I need to sacrifice? I can deal with the demise of the V8 but of course I don't like it.:mad:
 
With the $20K VinFast on its way, the era of EVs is coming just as fast as the Hondas, Toyotas, Datsuns and VWs of the 70s killed off big block V8 cars and replaced them with 4 cylinder front drive.

Tesla now sells significantly more cars than Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep and RAM combined will sell this year.

If Stellantis doesn’t lead with EV, it will be making the same mistake that Chrysler under Townsend did when responding to four cylinder cars. Except this time, there won’t be another federal bailout nor Lee Iacocca to save the day. (Iacocca, BTW, was trying to convince Chrysler to start making plug in hybrids back in the 2000s and warned that ignoring the market was a huge mistake).

It’s time to accept the market changes and roll with them, rather than live in the past.
 
This won't happen in my lifetime. I won't go for public charging like trying to get air for your tires. Upgrade house with charger🤑Besides they MUST get the infrastructure up to date to support all this need for electricity. You can still purchase used gasoline vehicles as there will be a market for ICE. But if gas stations start to disappear?🤑😱😵‍💫.....
Move to Wyoming where by 2035 electric vehicles will be banned. This state is the capital of fossil fuels and it's what they produce.
 
Speaking of charging infrastructure, here is a Stellantis press release from last summer.

Charging Your Way: Stellantis Launches Free2move Charge to Make It 'Easy to Always Be Charged'
NEWS PROVIDED BY
Stellantis ->
AMSTERDAM, June 27, 2023 /PRNewswire/ --

- Complete charging ecosystem aims to deliver seamless electric vehicle (EV) charging and energy management for customers

- Free2move Charge embodies the e-ABC Promise: easy to Always Be Charged

- Products and services launching now in North America and expanding to Europe

- Free2move Charge is the first ecosystem of charging hardware, software and services under the new Stellantis Charging & Energy Business Unit, an accretive business supporting Dare Forward 2030

Stellantis today launched Free2move Charge, a 360-degree ecosystem that will seamlessly deliver charging and energy management to address all electric-vehicle (EV) customer needs, anywhere and in any way. Managed by the new Stellantis Charging & Energy Business Unit, Free2move Charge addresses electric-vehicle customer needs at home, at work and on the go.

"As the pace of mainstream EV adoption accelerates, our customers need us to be more than just a mobility provider," said Ricardo Stamatti, senior vice president, Stellantis Charging & Energy Business Unit. "We are taking the lead in establishing a dedicated business unit that will support our bold electrification strategy and act as a natural extension of our iconic brands. Free2move Charge is the first product rolling out, exemplifying our purpose of delivering performance, value, sustainability and electrified mobility freedom for all."

e-ABC Promise: easy to Always Be Charged
​
Making it easy to Always Be Charged (e-ABC Promise), Free2move Charge also makes it smart, understanding users' needs and optimizing overall energy management to improve efficiency, reliability and access, reducing the total cost of ownership and maximizing environmental benefits.

Working with a Free2move e-Genius team, customers will be able to create a personalized package they can change and adapt at any time during the ownership experience, allowing it to evolve and always be tailored to their needs. e- Genuis support will be available first in Europe.

By removing barriers to battery-electric vehicle ownership, including charging anxiety, Free2move Charge is a key tool to achieve the goals of the Stellantis Dare Forward 2030 strategic plan, including reaching a 100% passenger-car battery- electric vehicle (BEV) sales mix in Europe and a 50% passenger-car and light-duty truck BEV sales mix in the United States by 2030.

Free2move Charge: Built on Three Pillars
​
Free2move Charge Home delivers private customers support with installation, financing and warranty of home charging and other energy hardware and services. Options can range from AC charging cables and wall boxes today to Vehicle-2-Home, Vehicle-2-Grid, and complete energy management systems with cutting-edge features like touch-free wireless solutions and inductive robot charging under development for future releases

Free2move Charge Business tackles all hurdles as a one-stop-shop platform with a full suite of charging and energy services: early-on support, estimation of initial and future running costs, right-sizing of charging infrastructure, installation, maintenance and public charging access while on the go

Free2move Charge GO guarantees seamless access to the largest possible curated network of public charging points through partners in North America and Europe, as well as other regions to be announced soon. In addition to access, payment and 24-7 support, Free2move Charge GO will progressively launch leading features like Plug and Charge, reservations, loyalty programs, subscriptions, prepaid packages, single invoice/billing and even deliver a charge to a requested location when needed

Free2move Charge will harness the power of the Stellantis Energy Cloud, seamlessly integrating with vehicle-branded mobile apps and the state-of-the-art STLA SmartCockpit platform launching in 2024 to deliver fast, intelligent routes and charging recommendations to customers based on their actual usage and needs. Free2move Charge will guide
Stellantis customers through an onboarding process to understand their individual needs, allowing for deep personalization and using AI learning to constantly improve its knowledge about the most convenient individual charging experience.

Free2move eSolutions, a Stellantis tech company, will continue to develop and provide industry-leading charging hardware that supports the Free2move Charge ecosystem, as well as non-captive customers, and work with other industry leaders to bring more EV charging solutions to market.
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Tesla owners seem to be hitting 200,000 miles with only losing about 10% of battery capacity. That seems pretty acceptable to me.
 
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