FCA & PSA Full Year 2020 Earnings & Carlos' First Wall Street Conference Call (9:30 U.S. EST) 11.4%. EBIT North American Margin

[AlexB]

@pennellotref

Can you say what did Tavares said about future products/platforms for North American market? PSA platforms and plans for them.

He avoided saying any one underpinnings over another, he did use the term ''PSA tools'' in regard to Europe.

 

[Bili]

he did use the term ''PSA tools'' in regard to Europe.

And that doesn't bode well for brands like Alfa Romeo.

As you know I'm not Tavares' fan since December 2019. Let's say that some of Italian brands will have a very hard time if styling and immature technology is the only way of their fight against Germans. Total failure would be if they opt for French powertrains.

But then IMO he made wrong calls with pushing Pug as the European brand #1 while that Pug can't outsold Fiat globally. Peugeot family wish in the cards?
And pushing three premium brands. No one did so. Not to mention that DS has no history and that brand ethos is nothing like Alfa Romeo, zero potential sharing in mechanical department. But what do I know

Yes, I'm pissed off.

 

[Bili]

Interesting article about Polish factory:

Autorewolucja. Tychy w roli pioniera - nikt wcześniej tego nie robił

Tychy wchodzą w nowy koncern z wielkim przytupem. Nie dość, że będą pierwszym zakładem poza Włochami, który będzie produkował Alfa Romeo, to jeszcze są pierwszą fabryką wielkiej firmy, w której będą prowadzone wspólne projekty, zakorzenione

www.wnp.pl

Something sounds fishy. Relatively low investment of around or less than 200 million euros for three new products but platform will be from PSA. Factory is ex-FCA.

@TripleT can you please say more about this?

 

[TripleT]

So they are going to completely refurbish a plant to a PSA build points and windows. And develop entirely new models for 200 million dollars???? Unless they are slapping new grill inserts into a existing models seems they are several billion short on funds.

 

[Bili]

@AlexB

I think that my friend @pennellotref somewhere said that currently there is no plan to federalize PSA platforms.

 

[Tony K]

Carlos states we (Stellantis) will never forget the horrible management of Chrysler/North American business by Daimler

SHOTS FIRED!!!

Solution: More cars, less SUV.

Crossovers are just taller cars. Heck, Stelvio is really not super tall compared to say a Grand Cherokee. It's certainly more aerodynamic. It has a better Cd than a 2006 Charger, but I don't know the total drag numbers. It sits higher, so I presume it will be significantly more draggy being only 0.01 better Cd. The base Giulia is nearing the Teslas.

Vehicle	Cd
2013 Mercedes-Benz CLA BlueEfficiency	0.22
2017 Tesla Model 3	0.23
2016 Tesla Model S	0.24
Giulia (952 - Giorgio)	0.25
98-01 Concorde	0.288
Stelvio	0.32
2011-14 300C	0.32
Giulia QV (952)	0.32
2006 Charger	0.33
Dodge Durango (WK2 based)	0.35
Jeep Grand Cherokee (WK2)	0.37
Jeep Wrangler (JL)	0.454

 

[AlexB]

And that doesn't bode well for brands like Alfa Romeo.

As you know I'm not Tavares' fan since December 2019. Let's say that some of Italian brands will have a very hard time if styling and immature technology is the only way of their fight against Germans. Total failure would be if they opt for French powertrains.

But then IMO he made wrong calls with pushing Pug as the European brand #1 while that Pug can't outsold Fiat globally. Peugeot family wish in the cards?
And pushing three premium brands. No one did so. Not to mention that DS has no history and that brand ethos is nothing like Alfa Romeo, zero potential sharing in mechanical department. But what do I know

Yes, I'm pissed off.

So they are going to completely refurbish a plant to a PSA build points and windows. And develop entirely new models for 200 million dollars???? Unless they are slapping new grill inserts into a existing models seems they are several billion short on funds.

I don't where ''some'' got the concept that Carlos would care less about margins than Sergio(you know the place). That dumbfounds me. It seems John is wiling to allow Carlos drop heritage & DNA in the name of '' The real merger'' in a couple of years, so getting cost savings targets together with increasing margins without touching employment ,and getting the stock price over $25 is the main judgment factors of Carlos's performance.

 

[TripleT]

I don't where ''some'' got the concept that Carlos would care less about margins than Sergio(you know the place). That dumbfounds me. It seems John is wiling to allow Carlos drop heritage & DNA in the name of '' The real merger'' in a couple of years, so getting cost savings targets together with increasing margins without touching employment ,and getting the stock price over $25 is the main judgment factors of Carlos's performance.

I don't care really ...... I just don't know how you do squat with $200M you can't do a mild refresh for this amount of funds, let alone revise a plant and create 3 different models.

 

[Bili]

I don't where ''some'' got the concept that Carlos would care less about margins than Sergio(you know the place). That dumbfounds me. It seems John is wiling to allow Carlos drop heritage & DNA in the name of '' The real merger'' in a couple of years, so getting cost savings targets together with increasing margins without touching employment ,and getting the stock price over $25 is the main judgment factors of Carlos's performance.

I'm just saying that PSA policy will not work on every other brand, demographics or country.

Today they said that the 2 most important markets for Alfa Romeo in the future should be Italy and US. Am I right?
In that case no need for Alfa to share with PSA brands or to use PSA mechanics. There are Dodge, Jeep and Maserati which would be much better partners for sharing than DS or Lancia.

 

[AlexB]

I'm just saying that PSA policy will not work on every other brand, demographics or country.

Today they said that the 2 most important markets for Alfa Romeo in the future should be Italy and US. Am I right?
In that case no need for Alfa to share with PSA brands or to use PSA mechanics. There are Dodge, Jeep and Maserati which would be much better partners for sharing than DS or Lancia.

Europe and U.S. for Alfa.
''needs to Target better''.

 

[AlexB]

I don't care really ...... I just don't know how you do squat with $200M you can't do a mild refresh for this amount of funds, let alone revise a plant and create 3 different models.

Yeah, that likely undersell the figure.

 

[TripleT]

I'm just saying that PSA policy will not work on every other brand, demographics or country.

Today they said that the 2 most important markets for Alfa Romeo in the future should be Italy and US. Am I right?
In that case no need for Alfa to share with PSA brands or to use PSA mechanics. There are Dodge, Jeep and Maserati which would be much better partners for sharing than DS or Lancia.

Ding ding ding...

WInner

Loser

 

[Bili]

Europe and U.S. for Alfa.
''needs to Target better''.

Tavares could get stranded like a whale.
With PSA in 6 or 7 years he burned all he could burn in 2 out of 3 regions. Don't forget that.

I think that they will fail in China. They will pick wrong brands and strategy. It seems that they are going in that direction. Actually we will not more when they name brands for China and which ones will be locally produced.

 

[pennellotref]

@pennellotref

Can you say what did Tavares said about future products/platforms for North American market? PSA platforms and plans for them.

He said pretty much nothing. Just a giant will see regarding current and future PSA platforms. They're not federalized and Stellantis is not in the process of federalizing them at least for the time being. In a nutshell nothing has been decided neither if Stell. will do it nor if it won't....

 

[Bili]

He said pretty much nothing. Just a giant will see regarding current and future PSA platforms. They're not federalized and Stellantis is not in the process of federalizing them at least for the time being. In a nutshell nothing has been decided neither if Stell. will do it nor if it won't....

But that says something about timing. It takes time to federalize platform and to implement production of such products at North American factories.

 

[AlexB]

@TripleT @Bili
Its the same concern @TripleT had with a ICE ban in the U.S 2035..........but getting answer is from Mary...........

Philippe Houchois -- Jefferies -- Analyst

''Yes, good morning, and thanks for having me on the call. Following on to this discussion about this aspiration and your target or aspiration for 2035. I'm trying to understand, thinking 10 years out or so. If we assume that SAAR grows relatively slowly in a mature market and GM targets no ICE by 2035, what happens if adoption is lagging significantly, let's say, 50% or so? Logically, GM must be prepared to either shrink volume or compensate hardware revenue with other source of revenue.''

''And keeping in mind, for me, shrinking if you got more growth and better margin, it's not, let's say, negative for the markets. It's quite the contrary. Expectedly, if you don't want to shrink or not planning to shrink, you need to work on squeezing your competitors especially basically making their growth in EVs more difficult. I'm just trying to understand strategically, over the next 10, 15 years, is GM ready to shrink or is GM going to be aggressive? I'm trying to understand.''

Mary Barra -- Chairman and Chief Executive Officer

Yeah, I -- I think we're going to be aggressive because I think we've got the technology, we've got the talent. We have the manufacturing capability. We already sell more vehicles in the United States, and we're No. 2 in China.

So I think we're well positioned because of our current brand strength around the world and our position and then with the technology that we're bringing forward. So we don't plan on shrinking. We plan on growing, especially if you look at in the United States on the coast, we don't get what I would say is our fair share of the market. That's a growth opportunity right there.

Mary is full of...... grow marketshare is the oldest GM CEO lie.General Motors (GM) Q4 2020 Earnings Call Transcript | The Motley Fool
But hence the reason why Stellantis-GM merger........the need to scale in a decline SAAR and Cut,Cut Cut.

 

[pennellotref]

But that says something about timing. It takes time to federalize platform and to implement production of such products at North American factories.

Yes of course. I guess we need to wait for the Capital Markets Day to shed some light on the matter.

 

[pennellotref]

@TripleT @Bili
Its the same concern @TripleT had with a ICE ban in the U.S 2035..........but getting answer is from Mary...........


Mary is full of...... grow marketshare is the oldest GM CEO lie.General Motors (GM) Q4 2020 Earnings Call Transcript | The Motley Fool
But hence the reason why Stellantis-GM merger........the need to scale in a decline SAAR and Cut,Cut Cut.

USA and a widely adopted electric mobility cannot be on the same sentence until the US doesn't get its **** together infrastructure-wise.
Europe is on another level on that matter.

 

[Bili]

Yes of course. I guess we need to wait for the Capital Markets Day to shed some light on the matter.

My comment was also aimed at Windsor factory. First publicly known factory to get multienergy platofrm according to the latest collective agreement between FCA and UNIFOR. Multienergy is usually used in PSA's speech.

 

[Bili]

USA and widely adopted electric mobility cannot be on the same sentence until the US doesn't get its **** together infrastructure-wise.
Europe is on another level on that matter.

I'm not so optimistic about Europe and I think that actually European push is for electric is because VAG asked some politicians to do so.