Why Can't Stellantis Build A Next-Gen HEMI® Engine?

In the rapidly evolving landscape of automotive technology, the debate over the future of internal combustion engines rages on. While many automakers are pivoting towards electric vehicles (EVs), stalwarts like General Motors (GM) and Ford are reaffirming their commitment to the classic V8 engine. This raises an intriguing question: why isn’t Stellantis, the parent company … (read full article...)

 

[bill burke]

Your insight is spot on, but it seems Stellantis may have learned too late that abandoning the V-8 was a disastrous decision. Regrettably, although to Hurricane has applications in the Jeep and Ram brands, Dodge buyers will spurn those engines because no matter how they try to spin them, those turbo six’s will never get a Dodge loyalists on board. I’m Dodge to the bone, but I fear this short sighted, politically driven decision could destroy the Dodge brand and a next generation Hemi would save Dodge. It’s called sound thinking.
Your post is painful because the logic is so obvious, so technically achievable and just the right thing to do for Dodge. It hurts because electrification is not going according to the green crowds expectations and any common sense person could have told them that that would happen. Americans are not Europeans and Soccer is not NFL Football and the sound of a Formula 1 car does not satisfy like a Super Stock Hemi to the ears that matter to Dodge. Build that new Hemi for heavens sake. Avoid disaster !

 

[vbondjr1]

Correct me if I am mistaken, but I don't actually remember Stellantis saying that they weren't going to make V8 engines anymore in the first place. What was said was the Hemi was going away and "that engine, in that platform" was what was being decommissioned, referring to the Hemi/Hellcat V8's and the Current muscle car platform of the Challenger, Charger and Chrysler 300 sedan. It may be possible that Dodge is working on something like that, which would explain the delays of seeing upcoming cars the fact that the brand is running silent right now. Would it be cool to see a next-gen Mopar with a 4.7L Magnum or 5.2L Magnum emissions friendly DOHC V8 under the hood, absolutely! As much as I love the idea of the Hurricanes and Hybrids and all of that other stuff I always talk about, I'd be absolutely stoked to see a few V8s still kicking around under the hood of the next gen muscle cars and trucks. I mean Ford can make 480hp to 500hp from a 5.0L DOHC V8 and 760hp on a Supercharged 5.2L, I'm sure Stellantis could do the same. Even still, I wouldn't abandon the idea of the Hurricane-6 powertrains as they have alot of potential and really can be useful in so many applications. I don't know how good a hybrid setup would be with this powertrain but if they could get something like that to work and we get a few emissions friendly small V8 engines with a bit of hybrid tech thrown in the mix to keep the EPA happy then we're good! I'm a Dodge fan from the SRT4 side to the SRT Redeye side and everything in between. It's cool to speculate and honestly it would be nice to see a V8 in the next gen cars. Time will tell.

 

[Crocodile]

I am becoming extremely tired of the useless sentimentality for V8 engines. Stellantis have invested in a turbo straight 6 which is more fuel efficient, produces fewer noxious emissions, and produces more power than the V8s. Time to move on guys. The past is slowly going away, as are people of your ilk. You are hankering for a distant past that is going the way of hula hoops, vinyl 12" long play records and black and white cathode ray tube televisions.

Time to open your minds to the possibilities of the future.

 

[Desert Bum]

Heads need to roll at Stellantis on the business decisions made regarding ICE powered vehicles. Ford stated they lost nearly 5 Billion dollars on their EV endeavors, and delayed a mega battery plant due to market uncertainties. So what does the good ole U.S. Gov't do? Give Ford and Samsung (Foreign Entity) a 9 Billion dollar grant to keep the ball rolling on the EV fiasco. GM smartened up and invested 860 million in next gen V-8 Tech, And what does Stellantis do? Cancel the most iconic V8's ever produced..... Hell, the marketing value of the Hemi moniker sold more trucks than you could imagine. And I will tell you this.... that turbo six is gonna fall flat on its face, mark my words. I would wager Stellantis read the comments in reference to the Daytona EV and the laughable tow range on EV trucks and cringed. Listen to me and the people who buy your product: WE DO NOT WANT AN ELECTRIC MUSCLE CAR OR PICKUP TRUCK. And who is the genius who pulled the plug on the "L" platform cars? Are you brain dead? That R&D was paid for 10 years ago, those cars were cash friggin' cows.... Challenger outsold the Mustang for what... two or three years in a row on what would be considered an outdated platform. You would have had a complete and total lock on Law Enforcement vehicles, again on a platform paid for Loooong ago. Or maybe you just want Dodge to fade into that goodnight.

 

[Desert Bum]

I am becoming extremely tired of the useless sentimentality for V8 engines. Stellantis have invested in a turbo straight 6 which is more fuel efficient, produces fewer noxious emissions, and produces more power than the V8s. Time to move on guys. The past is slowly going away, as are people of your ilk. You are hankering for a distant past that is going the way of hula hoops, vinyl 12" long play records and black and white cathode ray tube televisions.

Time to open your minds to the possibilities of the future.

Good sir,

I do not know your background in the automotive world, however you are wrong on many levels. Forced induction in place of raw natural power is a huge mistake. Case in point: the Ford EcoBoost, when driven like a V8 gets disgusting fuel mileage, and engine failures are all too common. You have to constantly keep your foot in it to mimic what a modern V8 drives and accelerates like. Let's not even get into wear and tear issues... My oldest Son is a heavy line Mechanic at a Ford dealership, they are mockingly called ECO-BOOMS. The Denver warehouse keeps a minimum of 80 engines on hand to meet warranty demands. My V8 brothers, people of ilk as you state, are not going anywhere. You see my Son and Daughters grew up listening to my praises and tales of the mighty American V8, they grew up in the back seat of many a Mopar muscle car. Try as you may, but you will fail miserably trying to convince my kids and hundreds of thousands just like them an EV or 6 cylinder.... no matter the turbo amount will ever replace the smoothness, power, and reliability of a V8.

 

[redriderbob]

Correct me if I am mistaken, but I don't actually remember Stellantis saying that they weren't going to make V8 engines anymore in the first place. What was said was the Hemi was going away and "that engine, in that platform" was what was being decommissioned, referring to the Hemi/Hellcat V8's and the Current muscle car platform of the Challenger, Charger and Chrysler 300 sedan. It may be possible that Dodge is working on something like that, which would explain the delays of seeing upcoming cars the fact that the brand is running silent right now. Would it be cool to see a next-gen Mopar with a 4.7L Magnum or 5.2L Magnum emissions friendly DOHC V8 under the hood, absolutely! As much as I love the idea of the Hurricanes and Hybrids and all of that other stuff I always talk about, I'd be absolutely stoked to see a few V8s still kicking around under the hood of the next gen muscle cars and trucks. I mean Ford can make 480hp to 500hp from a 5.0L DOHC V8 and 760hp on a Supercharged 5.2L, I'm sure Stellantis could do the same. Even still, I wouldn't abandon the idea of the Hurricane-6 powertrains as they have alot of potential and really can be useful in so many applications. I don't know how good a hybrid setup would be with this powertrain but if they could get something like that to work and we get a few emissions friendly small V8 engines with a bit of hybrid tech thrown in the mix to keep the EPA happy then we're good! I'm a Dodge fan from the SRT4 side to the SRT Redeye side and everything in between. It's cool to speculate and honestly it would be nice to see a V8 in the next gen cars. Time will tell.

False, the BGE HEMI® V8 in the Ram HD will continue on

 

[redriderbob]

Heads need to roll at Stellantis on the business decisions made regarding ICE powered vehicles. Ford stated they lost nearly 5 Billion dollars on their EV endeavors, and delayed a mega battery plant due to market uncertainties. So what does the good ole U.S. Gov't do? Give Ford and Samsung (Foreign Entity) a 9 Billion dollar grant to keep the ball rolling on the EV fiasco. GM smartened up and invested 860 million in next gen V-8 Tech, And what does Stellantis do? Cancel the most iconic V8's ever produced..... Hell, the marketing value of the Hemi moniker sold more trucks than you could imagine. And I will tell you this.... that turbo six is gonna fall flat on its face, mark my words. I would wager Stellantis read the comments in reference to the Daytona EV and the laughable tow range on EV trucks and cringed. Listen to me and the people who buy your product: WE DO NOT WANT AN ELECTRIC MUSCLE CAR OR PICKUP TRUCK. And who is the genius who pulled the plug on the "L" platform cars? Are you brain dead? That R&D was paid for 10 years ago, those cars were cash friggin' cows.... Challenger outsold the Mustang for what... two or three years in a row on what would be considered an outdated platform. You would have had a complete and total lock on Law Enforcement vehicles, again on a platform paid for Loooong ago. Or maybe you just want Dodge to fade into that goodnight.

It's evident that there's a strong appetite for a next-generation Charger and Challenger from Dodge. Many enthusiasts and fans are eager to see these iconic models evolve. In conversations with various stakeholders, it's become clear that there's a desire for Dodge to offer both electric vehicle (EV) options and the beloved HEMI engines.

The HEMI engines hold a special place in the hearts of diehard enthusiasts who cherish not only the power but also the unmistakable sound. They value the ability to work on their vehicles and customize them to their liking. Importantly, the inclusion of HEMI engines alongside EV options could help manage costs, particularly for those who still prefer internal combustion engines (ICE).

On the other hand, EVs have emerged as a promising avenue for top-tier performance models. Their instant torque and high-performance capabilities can take these cars to new heights. Additionally, EVs can be a valuable option for customers in regions with strict emissions regulations, such as CARB (California Air Resources Board) restrictions.

 

[Desert Bum]

Your insight is spot on, but it seems Stellantis may have learned too late that abandoning the V-8 was a disastrous decision. Regrettably, although to Hurricane has applications in the Jeep and Ram brands, Dodge buyers will spurn those engines because no matter how they try to spin them, those turbo six’s will never get a Dodge loyalists on board. I’m Dodge to the bone, but I fear this short sighted, politically driven decision could destroy the Dodge brand and a next generation Hemi would save Dodge. It’s called sound thinking.
Your post is painful because the logic is so obvious, so technically achievable and just the right thing to do for Dodge. It hurts because electrification is not going according to the green crowds expectations and any common sense person could have told them that that would happen. Americans are not Europeans and Soccer is not NFL Football and the sound of a Formula 1 car does not satisfy like a Super Stock Hemi to the ears that matter to Dodge. Build that new Hemi for heavens sake. Avoid disaster !

Bill,

We have crossed paths on several forums, I value your opinions and comments. You are 100% correct, once you have owned A Hemi powered truck or car, any V8 powered vehicle actually, nothing else is an option. The article states Stellantis was offsetting emissions violations purchasing credits.... Who issues these credits, who dictates how many credits are issued, and where does the money go when credits are purchased? The sentiment on EV vehicles is starting to go negative, many videos of child slave labor mining Cobalt, youtube videos showcasing trips that would normally take 4 or five hours taking twice as long and the insane price per mile when paying for the supercharging option. Many Memes showing trainloads of coal as "Tesla Fuel" and small gas powered generators in the trunks. Range PTSD is a real phenomenon, many of the chargers are either broken, vandalized, or you'll wait hours to use one.

 

[Desert Bum]

It's evident that there's a strong appetite for a next-generation Charger and Challenger from Dodge. Many enthusiasts and fans are eager to see these iconic models evolve. In conversations with various stakeholders, it's become clear that there's a desire for Dodge to offer both electric vehicle (EV) options and the beloved HEMI engines.

The HEMI engines hold a special place in the hearts of diehard enthusiasts who cherish not only the power but also the unmistakable sound. They value the ability to work on their vehicles and customize them to their liking. Importantly, the inclusion of HEMI engines alongside EV options could help manage costs, particularly for those who still prefer internal combustion engines (ICE).

On the other hand, EVs have emerged as a promising avenue for top-tier performance models. Their instant torque and high-performance capabilities can take these cars to new heights. Additionally, EVs can be a valuable option for customers in regions with strict emissions regulations, such as CARB (California Air Resources Board) restrictions.

Tell me something...... Who decided California sets the emissions standards for all the other states? Back in the day, if you lived in Cal, you paid for California emissions, SMOG was their problem. All other states didn't have the additional equipment. Have you ever been to a dragstrip where a Tesla Plaid or 100 ludicrous was making passes? The amperage draw is so violent, that batteries overheat constantly, there better be a charging station close by if you want to make more than 5 or 6 passes. No sound, no visceral excitement, no cool wheelies..... BORING. And everyone either forgets or ignores the fact there is an extension cord hooked to a coal burning powerplant charging their "zero emission EV"

 

[Devin]

Didn't even read the thread but I can say two words and it will get you all into a tizzy, "click bait". No confirmation that we are stepping away from the V-design. Everyone these days wants to argue, make it about their beliefs and judge based on the political climate.
Sit in your dark hole and let those with common sense, education and heart make decisions - the world will be better without your contribution.

 

[T/A392]

Great article. Whatever happens to Chrysler Group, and specifically Dodge from the ending of the Hemi engine, I place all blame completely on the Biden administration and his anti fossil fuel EPA policies.

Dodge CEO Tim Kuniskis wrapped it up nicely at one of his press conferences, he said: it’s 1972 all over again. Guys who know about mopar and muscle car history know exactly what that means.

 

[JDHulk666]

It is seriously beyond a shame how Chrysler Group just cannot be their own boss.

They keep ending up under a group that insists on either hamstringing them if not out right handicapping them.

They're American. Let them do what the other American groups are doing. They can keep their fun stuff while ALSO having eco friendly fluff. Why can't Chrysler?

These "partnerships" need to be far more open to letting their various branches actually serve their respective markets in their fashion. No force authoritarian over-rule just for being involved.

 

[TripleT]

Of course, FCA with a corporate cousin could mimic the single brand Ford pathway of offering a extremely rare and expensive V8 option. Throw the name Hemi on it even though it has nothing in common with the much beloved but now obsolete powerplant that over decades they squeezed out every possible HP before it literally started popping heads .... low volume basically handbuilt DI with overhead cams V8 eingine.

The question is would it be more powerful than Hurricane Six? Ford doesn't even have this as mass-market option. We already know the Hurricane has 1000hp production potential. Race versions are running around with 1500hp. Would it be faster with it being heavier, unbalanced, and less room to secure the heads? MAYBE? mmmmmmaaaaaaayyyyyybbbe

Could they throw the old powerplant with it escalating fines, cost to certify it just to be slower, heavier, thirstier, and louder. Not to mention the "Last Call" lawsuits that would inevitably happen.

I suppose .... and I am sure there would be those who would buy it. I Love my car and even considering garaging it. But I can tell you hell would freeze over before I pay for the new model with the old powerplant just to get embarrassed 0-60 and in the quarter by what we already know would be a full second, just to brag "Well it is sounds better" ..... "Good for you, I couldn't hear it from how far behind you are"

 

[vbondjr1]

False, the BGE HEMI® V8 in the Ram HD will continue on

gotcha. It does make sense for them to continue on with the 6.4L as a gas engine for the HD trucks. Can't see the Hurricane being useful there. Honestly at this point, it'd be nice to actually know something concrete so we can all stop speculating.

 

[ernioe]

As an old gearhead an improved hemi sounds (pun intended) great. They could do build a better hemi but it's time to wake up and realize that would be the wrong answer. It is time to move on.

 

[Mattsomeonewithansrt]

I am becoming extremely tired of the useless sentimentality for V8 engines. Stellantis have invested in a turbo straight 6 which is more fuel efficient, produces fewer noxious emissions, and produces more power than the V8s. Time to move on guys. The past is slowly going away, as are people of your ilk. You are hankering for a distant past that is going the way of hula hoops, vinyl 12" long play records and black and white cathode ray tube televisions.

Time to open your minds to the possibilities of the future.

The future isn’t electric that’s just a novelty. It’s going to be E-Fuels. V8s will make a comeback mark my words. 6 cylinders don’t sound the same they sound like little fart boxes. They’ll never have the tenacity and spirit of a S/C Twin Screw or NA 6.4. Let me also tell you something else about the future mr. Crocodile electric vehicles Arn’t that much more efficient. If you really want to save the world we all need to switch to E-Bikes which are 20-50x more efficient than any car or truck. 100 mile charge on your Tesla will get my E Bike 2000 miles. So think about that. I do my part as well I got 2 hellcats and a transit connect for work daily and my personally daily is a dual battery dual motor E Bike. This is the future it’s called comprise it’s about flexibility not all one side or the other.

 

[Mattsomeonewithansrt]

I am becoming extremely tired of the useless sentimentality for V8 engines. Stellantis have invested in a turbo straight 6 which is more fuel efficient, produces fewer noxious emissions, and produces more power than the V8s. Time to move on guys. The past is slowly going away, as are people of your ilk. You are hankering for a distant past that is going the way of hula hoops, vinyl 12" long play records and black and white cathode ray tube televisions.

Time to open your minds to the possibilities of the future.

The future isn’t electric that’s just a novelty. It’s going to be E-Fuels. V8s will make a comeback mark my words. 6 cylinders don’t sound the same they sound like little fart boxes. They’ll never have the tenacity and spirit of a S/C Twin Screw or NA 6.4. Let me also tell you something else about the future mr. Crocodile electric vehicles Arn’t that much more efficient. If you really want to save the world we all need to switch to E-Bikes which are 20-50x more efficient than any car or truck. 100 mile charge on your Tesla will get my E Bike 2000 miles. So think about that. I do my part as well I got 2 hellcats and a transit connect for work daily and my personally daily is a dual battery dual motor E Bike. This is the future it’s called comprise it’s about flexibility not all one side or the other.

 

[Mattsomeonewithansrt]

I am becoming extremely tired of the useless sentimentality for V8 engines. Stellantis have invested in a turbo straight 6 which is more fuel efficient, produces fewer noxious emissions, and produces more power than the V8s. Time to move on guys. The past is slowly going away, as are people of your ilk. You are hankering for a distant past that is going the way of hula hoops, vinyl 12" long play records and black and white cathode ray tube televisions.

Time to open your minds to the possibilities of the future.

The future isn’t electric that’s just a novelty. It’s going to be E-Fuels. V8s will make a comeback mark my words. 6 cylinders don’t sound the same they sound terrible. They’ll never have the tenacity and spirit of a S/C Twin Screw or NA 6.4. Let me also tell you something else about the future mr. Crocodile electric vehicles Arn’t that much more efficient. If you really want to save the world we all need to switch to E-Bikes which are 20-50x more efficient than any Electric or hybrid car or truck. 100 mile charge on your Tesla will get my E Bike 2000 miles. So think about that. I do my part as well I got 2 hellcats and a transit connect for work daily and my personally daily is a dual battery dual motor E Bike. This is the future it’s called comprise it’s about flexibility not all one side or the other.

 

[TripleT]

gotcha. It does make sense for them to continue on with the 6.4L as a gas engine for the HD trucks. Can't see the Hurricane being useful there. Honestly at this point, it'd be nice to actually know something concrete so we can all stop speculating.

Why wouldn't it be useful. The best option in the Truck is DI Turbo straight Six.

500 HP/475 lb-ft of torque vs 410 HP/ 429 lb-ft of torque

How is that not Useful?

No they aren't selling the future... They are selling the now.