Alfa Romeo B-segment crossover cancelled, Jeep and Fiat pushed back?

[Bili]

All mighty PSA management doing their best:

The start of production (SOP) schedule for the three models is listed below. Sales normally begin three to four months after SOP.

• The Jeep, which is code-named project 516, is due to go into production in November 2022, initially with a gasoline engine. A full-electric version will follow in February 2023 and a mild-hybrid version in January 2024. Batteries for the full-electric version will initially be supplied by Chinese supplier CATL, switching in July 2023 to another Chinese competitor, automaker BYD.
• Production of a small Fiat crossover, code-named project 364, is due to start in April 2023, with a BYD-equipped full-electric version following in May 2023 and mild hybrid in February 2024.

Previously, the Jeep was expected to start production in July 2022, followed by the Alfa Romeo in January 2023 and the Fiat in July 2023.

The front-wheel-drive mild-hybrid versions of the three vehicles will have an electric motor located between the engine and the transmission.

The Alfa Romeo version that is awaiting approval is due to start production with the full-electric version in October 2023, followed by a front-wheel-drive gasoline mild hybrid in March 2024 and an all-wheel drive in July 2024. Alfa’s small crossover is codenamed project 966.

Full article at: Jeep, Fiat small crossovers approved for production at Polish plant - Times News Express

 

[pumadog]

Is there a reliable source for this? And why the "AR cancelled" in your title when the article doesn't say so? If the dates are real, I don'd understand why the petrol version of the Alfa would start only 6 months after the e-version. Very late anyway.

 

[Bili]

Is there a reliable source for this? And why the "AR cancelled" in your title when the article doesn't say so? If the dates are real, I don'd understand why the petrol version of the Alfa would start only 6 months after the e-version. Very late anyway.

AN Europe is the original source.

If you take a look at Stellantis' platform related document then there is a 2nd gen CMP coming in Q4 2022. So at least Jeep is pushed back by 3 months. And of course all other projects by at least the same amount of time.

Add to that ex PSA's part of Stellantis fixation on CO2 emissions and cost cut and we got what we got, more delays and strategy changes.

Not to mention that ex PSA has hit some additional setbacks with their P2 MHEV program unlike FCA which will buy it from Magna/Getrag,

On this cars PSA wants to use PSA technique/powertrains. IMO two reasons may be behind this.

1. One is cost of switching production to more modern FCA GSE/FireFly engines.
2. The other could be more nationalistic. Keeping production and also R&D in France as much as possible.

Don't forget that decision has been made in South America. Decision to switch all to GSE engines. This switch of course is not attack on French jobs so they pulled it out more easily.

And one important thing. FCA wanted to make 5 door 500 on this platform. If this is true Stellantis wants it to switch to a small SUV along Centoventi/120 lines. This makes sense if Fiat is a Core (entry level brand. 500 family doesn't fit into this picture. Unfortunately I must say.

I don't know why is Alfa Romeo cancelled or pushed back. For me there could be 2 or maybe even 3 valid reasons. They want to bring bigger and more expensive Alfa first because of brand image. This IMO makes perfect sense.
Or maybe B segment model on not so good technical base as CMP doesn't make sense at all for a brand which aims high. This also makes sense. I mean, they would end up with 1.2 turbo petrol engine. How this fits Alfa Romeo brand image?
And finally maybe they are looming to bring Alfa production back to Italy. This is far fetched.

 

[pumadog]

1. One is cost of switching production to more modern FCA GSE/FireFly engines.
2. The other could be more nationalistic. Keeping production and also R&D in France as much as possible.

Or maybe B segment model on not so good technical base as CMP doesn't make sense at all for a brand which aims high. This also makes sense. I mean, they would end up with 1.2 turbo petrol engine. How this fits Alfa Romeo brand image?
And finally maybe they are looming to bring Alfa production back to Italy. This is far fetched.

Option one is logical for me. STLA small could be another story. Is there material about the differences between CMP v1 and v2?

Well, Alfa put the 0.9 TwinAir into the Mito … Of course it would be cool for brand image if they would bundle Alfa production in Italy. How about Brennero, normal Alfa B-Segment, new Ypsilon and new Panda in Pomigliano? Maybe Panda to Tychy instead of Alfa? They would have two "Alfa plants" that way – additional models from other brands allowed.

If they really push the B-SUV deep into 2023-2024, they need some other fresh product beside Tonale ASAP.

 

[Bili]

@pumadog

Good question, actually excellent.
Difference should be in materials but also in technology and (sub)systems used. The plan was to adopt a lot of ex-FCA tech on it. Not to mention that some form of AWD should be present. Currently CMP has many technical drawbacks. It just isn't designed as a worldwide platform although PSA guys would say otherwise. Maybe it's good for Europe and ex-PSA brands but for some it's not.

From what I've heard, and it's not just one source. Internal combustion engine part and infotainment, also most electronic bits, have been deemed superior on ex-FCA side. But electrification part will be majority ex-PSA. One of the main reasons is in house production of battery cells, electric motor and fake DCT (I don't know how to call it because it has a single clutch, suggestions are welcome). Most of those projects are through JVs and much of the engineering part is not on the ex-PSA. They want to have their own supply chain and be as cheap as possible.