Chrysler is here to stay

[Mopar392]

... at least according to Tavares for now

Stellantis Confirms Peugeot Not Coming to U.S., Focus to Be on Alfa, Chrysler

PSA said in 2016 that Peugeot would return to the U.S. in 10 years. Now Stellantis confirms it won't, and it will focus on Alfa Romeo in the U.S. market.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[TripleT]

BEVs.... Imported models.

 

[Archknight]

There's a beauty in this, as Chrysler is a blank slate. They could easily reskin models from Peugeot and DS to return Chrysler to its premium position among the NA brands. Chrysler deserves a unique line that does 4 things well as displayed with the Pacifica--style, fuel efficiency, technology and cargo carrying. If they were to do at least two cars I would suggest a hatchback/shooting brake and a reskinned 308. I know a lot of people would love to see the 300 stick around, but making Chrysler a FWD/AWD hybrid brand which could be based around Peugeot's new 8AT system and full electric line would make it unique among the US brands. CUVs can easily be switched over quickly to create cash generating machines. Taking a page from Acura however and giving distinct missions with the cars would promote a unique proposition for the brand. One suggestion would be to keep Peugeot's seat designs, but make them ventilated. Chrysler could also be allowed to have a torque vectoring AWD system.

Subcompact premium shooting brake (i.e. Ferrari FF except with 4 doors) would replace the defunct Guilietta from Alfa Romeo and make Chrysler's entry model more versatile while still offering sporty styling and performance to match.

Extended platform reskinned 308 styled a little more aggressive and allows them to move up the scale. Positioned as more of a A4/CT5/C-Class/3-series/TLX competitor but with flare and driving dynamics that are unmatched in the segment.

Also, allow both cars the same packaging as far as trims by simplifying their line ups into two trims (Sport and Luxury) instead of a dozen trim lines. Chrysler's base engine would be the 2.0T, which allows them to compete directly with other premium brands.

 

[TripleT]

except for few years in the 90s can someone point to a time in the Brands history that it had a full line of unique premium offerings.... and no the imperial brand doesn't count.

Near as I can tell, it mostly has been Content engineered models, and only a few. It just found itself in a odd spot given the death of the sedan in NA.

 

[Bili]

BEVs.... Imported models.

Windsor... It should be Windsor.

 

[TripleT]

BEV could come from Winsor.... you don't need a passport for that

 

[cgseller]

You saw what proper styling, some marketing splash, and targeting your audience can do with the first Chrysler 200. Even while cars were on the downside, that got a lot of attention for Chrysler as a brand.

Others here are right - a semi-blank slate. Even letting the 300 disappear for a short while may allow for a re-splash of content. Do you think that if Chrysler re-introduced 3 vehicles in 2023 (MY) after having only the Pacific and Voyager for 2022 that it would be industry grabbing. By that I mean would your grandparents talk about it at the dinner table? Would Saturday afternoon beer parties have that as a conversation (somewhere other than Detroit)? Surely the pundits would grab on to the sensational headliners of "Chrysler dying with only 1 vehicle) but there is some truth that bad publicity is still publicity.... especially when it is debunked and causes people to say - - hrmmm.

 

[TripleT]

Ford saved FCA a ton of money by failing in the 300 segment prior to implementing the new 300. Time to rethink the Luxury market....

Sedan is mostly dead, SUV is dominated rightly by Jeep that does command great Margins.... Lower margin Luxury brand makes about as no sense.

So where do you go from here. Upscale people movers, Tall Cars, high tech not Luxury appointments, exotic drivetrains, automated driving experience.

It is the missing Niche in NA brand .... You got SUV - Jeep, you got Trucks - Ram, You got Performance - Dodge, You got true exclusive Luxury - Maserati, You have premium - Alfa....

what is missing is Economy relaunch Fiat at all CDJR in Plymouths position - nearly the full line.

High tech High Efficiency People movement----- HERE!!! and a growth market. and high margin.

 

[Archknight]

Ford saved FCA a ton of money by failing in the 300 segment prior to implementing the new 300. Time to rethink the Luxury market....

Sedan is mostly dead, SUV is dominated rightly by Jeep that does command great Margins.... Lower margin Luxury brand makes about as no sense.

So where do you go from here. Upscale people movers, Tall Cars, high tech not Luxury appointments, exotic drivetrains, automated driving experience.

It is the missing Niche in NA brand .... You got SUV - Jeep, you got Trucks - Ram, You got Performance - Dodge, You got true exclusive Luxury - Maserati, You have premium - Alfa....

what is missing is Economy relaunch Fiat at all CDJR in Plymouths position - nearly the full line.

High tech High Efficiency People movement----- HERE!!! and a growth market. and high margin.

Sedans are dying for the mainstream brands, but not in the premium/luxury segment. Ford got rid of all its sedans in the US because none (including Lincoln) of them were exceptional, so they had a reason to abandon the market. However, Stellantis has the ability use the same models in different regions under different branding and offer different options. As I mentioned with Chrysler, they can move into two niche spaces with unique models, but still be profitable using existing platforms, hybrid tech, and premium accommodations (mix of Chrysler and PSA touches). Starting prices for the premium subcompact FWD model could be at 28K or higher against models like the A3, A/CLA, 2series, ILX replacement/CT4. This class apparently is still profitable with each of the brands sharing the base platforms with other models. This leaves a larger model like a Chrysler badged/reskinned 308 to start in the high 30K range.

Jeeps are usually the heaviest in their respective classes and not everyone wants a Jeep. Chrysler should have gotten their own crossovers based on the FWD platforms awhile ago, that were focused more on comfort and space with additional amenities (i.e. more seat adjustability, higher output sound systems) you couldn't get in Jeeps. No brand can survive now without at least one or two CUV/SUV models in the line up.

 

[AlexB]

Sedans are dying for the mainstream brands, but not in the premium/luxury segment. Ford got rid of all its sedans in the US because none (including Lincoln) of them were exceptional, so they had a reason to abandon the market. However, Stellantis has the ability use the same models in different regions under different branding and offer different options. As I mentioned with Chrysler, they can move into two niche spaces with unique models, but still be profitable using existing platforms, hybrid tech, and premium accommodations (mix of Chrysler and PSA touches). Starting prices for the premium subcompact FWD model could be at 28K or higher against models like the A3, A/CLA, 2series, ILX replacement/CT4. This class apparently is still profitable with each of the brands sharing the base platforms with other models. This leaves a larger model like a Chrysler badged/reskinned 308 to start in the high 30K range.

Jeeps are usually the heaviest in their respective classes and not everyone wants a Jeep. Chrysler should have gotten their own crossovers based on the FWD platforms awhile ago, that were focused more on comfort and space with additional amenities (i.e. more seat adjustability, higher output sound systems) you couldn't get in Jeeps. No brand can survive now without at least one or two CUV/SUV models in the line up.

A3/CT4 are dead products. VW & GM’s respective luxury Model 3 fighters will replace those product.

 

[Archknight]

A3/CT4 are dead products. VW & GM’s respective luxury Model 3 fighters will replace those product.

Ummm the A3 is about to replaced this year with an all new version, so it's far from being dead. The A3 also has a loyal following like GTi buyers.

The CT4 however, was never going to be a major player in the segment. Cadillac consistently screws up its cars, that's why they are always tweener models.

 

[Mopar392]

what is missing is Economy relaunch Fiat at all CDJR in Plymouths position - nearly the full line.

High tech High Efficiency People movement----- HERE!!! and a growth market. and high margin.

There are people who associates cheap cars with low quality.

What Chrysler needs is to be renovated.

For example, look at Mazda.
They are starting making name for themselves, with good packaged, well designed and good quality cars, yet it’s priced in the middle spectrum of its target market.

Japanese and Korean know how to make sedans hence they are still occupying the compact and mid size sedan segments.

I’m not saying Chrysler should enter a segment it can’t win, but what I’m saying the segment is still here.

As @Archknight said, use Jeep FWD crossovers as a start. Keep Fiat’s version in the market where Fiat is the most recognizable such as Europe and South America , but use Chrysler for markets such as NA and Middle East.

 

[AlexB]

Ummm the A3 is about to replaced this year with an all new version, so it's far from being dead. The A3 also has a loyal following like GTi buyers.

The CT4 however, was never going to be a major player in the segment. Cadillac consistently screws up its cars, that's why they are always tweener models.

Just because a new version comes out doesn't mean it not set for death by end of decade.

 

[AlexB]

There are people who associates cheap cars with low quality.

What Chrysler needs is to be renovated.

For example, look at Mazda.
They are starting making name for themselves, with good packaged, well designed and good quality cars, yet it’s priced in the middle spectrum of its target market.

Japanese and Korean know how to make sedans hence they are still occupying the compact and mid size sedan segments.

I’m not saying Chrysler should enter a segment it can’t win, but what I’m saying the segment is still here.

As @Archknight said, use Jeep FWD crossovers as a start. Keep Fiat’s version in the market where Fiat is the most recognizable such as Europe and South America , but use Chrysler for markets such as NA and Middle East.

Note Mazda center around crossovers. Also non of those Japanese and Korean OEM have North American business that makes 10% Earnings (profit) before Interest Taxes.
FIAT in South America isn't the same as FIAT in Europe (that was in the Stellantis management team announcement) so that idea about crossovers can't happen.

 

[cgseller]

Remember, volume does not equal profits for a public company. Profits make profits. Often you do that with volume, but you need not. Those who mentioned well positioned and exceptional products is what shareholders want to make profits. The Chrysler brand does not demand a premium, yet, but other brands have proven you can do it if you wait long enough.

Millennials like services. That is your upcoming generation that will start to purchase high price vehicles. Chrysler could rebrand itself as the vehicle that gives you an experience different from everyone else (think Apple). If that includes oil changes for life? Free loaner for life. Yearly detailing. 1 free radiotainment hardware upgrade per life (or even the option). 15% discount on a new Chrysler if you own this one for over 10 years (suggests it will last you 10 years and you will love it)....you get the picture. Change the experience for buyers and they will become a relationship. You will not get volume per se, but you don't need volume as much as you need to reestablish brand awareness. But you had better make quality top or you should offer a payback system for every time someone has a quality issue where their vehicle has a safety issue.

 

[Deckard Cain]

Remember, volume does not equal profits for a public company. Profits make profits. Often you do that with volume, but you need not. Those who mentioned well positioned and exceptional products is what shareholders want to make profits. The Chrysler brand does not demand a premium, yet, but other brands have proven you can do it if you wait long enough.

Millennials like services. That is your upcoming generation that will start to purchase high price vehicles. Chrysler could rebrand itself as the vehicle that gives you an experience different from everyone else (think Apple). If that includes oil changes for life? Free loaner for life. Yearly detailing. 1 free radiotainment hardware upgrade per life (or even the option). 15% discount on a new Chrysler if you own this one for over 10 years (suggests it will last you 10 years and you will love it)....you get the picture. Change the experience for buyers and they will become a relationship. You will not get volume per se, but you don't need volume as much as you need to reestablish brand awareness. But you had better make quality top or you should offer a payback system for every time someone has a quality issue where their vehicle has a safety issue.

Let me just tell you that the "upcoming generation" won't start purchasing high price vehicles like boomers or late X'ers. We've been through two of the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression. In the US the "upcoming generation" is choked in debts and are paid sh*t wages compared to what older generations got paid.

But I do agree with you that volume does not equal profits for a public company. And opposed to what some "brilliant" minds on that other forum defend, launching vehicles that sell with low profit per vehicle and compensating that with volume is the way to kill Chrysler. I am happy they won't pursue that strategy and I am glad that Chrysler will survive.

 

[Archknight]

Just because a new version comes out doesn't mean it not set for death by end of decade.

I get where you're coming from, because according to all automakers gasoline models will no longer be available by 2030-2035. Let's be realistic about this, Americans especially oil and gas companies will fight to keep their industries alive, while customers will not likely bend to a expensive new technology so easily. Once gas prices rise people will do the usual and start ditching SUVs again.

 

[Bili]

I get where you're coming from, because according to all automakers gasoline models will no longer be available by 2030-2035. Let's be realistic about this, Americans especially oil and gas companies will fight to keep their industries alive, while customers will not likely bend to a expensive new technology so easily. Once gas prices rise people will do the usual and start ditching SUVs again.

So... Are you telling that, even if in the rest of the world people are going after SUVs even with this electrification movement and electric-craze, US will stop buying SUVs?

That's bold statement.

 

[Archknight]

Just because a new version comes out doesn't mean it not set for death by end of decade.

I get where you're coming from, because according to all automakers gasoline models will no longer be available by 2030-2035. Let's be realistic about this, Americans especially oil and gas companies will fight to keep their industries alive, while customers will not likely bend to a new tech

So... Are you telling that, even if in the rest of the world people are going after SUVs even with this electrification movement and electric-craze, US will stop buying SUVs?

That's bold statement.

That's not what I said at all. SUV/CUVs are like any other period in history, this is their time. The electric craze is just that until there is the infrastructure in place, we can count this as being prepared. American shoppers are doing the usual while gas is cheap, buy big as soon as it spikes they'll want more fuel efficient smaller cars or full hybrids. Electrics have range anxiety tied to them and living situations will dictate how the public even responds to these things. You have a few screaming for them, but talking to people who actually shop electrification is the last thing on the list.

It's an environmental dream to eliminate ICE, but you can't expect people to abandon what they trust to something they aren't used to. Unless they are pulling up all gas stations and replacing them with charging stations, while ensuring every home, housing community and complex have adequate charging for every household--ICE is going to stick around for a long time to come.

 

[TripleT]

Anyone advocating for the return of sedans is advocating for massive loss of money, The capacity still is in excess of the demand. Not only in the USA but world wide. You all use your Google machines to help to monitor treads. 3 years behind what is planned. Push for efficiency doesn’t require a lose of passenger and cargo efficiency. If one loves the company it would not advocate for products people are unwilling to buy at margin. Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, Mazda and now the EU company’s are all working to diminish their sedan capacity as quickly as possible. That the market hasn’t been completely abandoned doesn’t mean the tread has reversed. If anything it is expanding. Again it is a false assumption the Efficiency requires a shape the is passenger compromised . BTW any claim that those abandoning the market was product related is false, it was entirely related to margin. Even with class leading features would still lose money, even going the opposite Mitsubishi lean, there was no margin, even Asian in a box no money. The it came down to using capacity at a lose, or at great margin. It is irresponsible to do anything else.