Alfa Romeo Tonale mule caught on the road

[pumadog]

If Giulia crossover means Giulia Sportwagon/Crosswagon I'm all for it. Bring it together with Giulia's "2nd generation" which is a big facelift + electric options technically.
I'm also happy for more offerings in the compact segments, maybe a Mito successor. But I can't imagine a good sports car on STLA medium.
And they just need an E segment model for overseas. America, Middle East, Asia.

 

[Bili]

@pennellotref

You just discovered what Duetto and Alfetta represent for Imparato.
New Giulietta... Who knows if Duetto is sports model or something else.

But sports model on FWD base when RWD is available is blasphemy.

 

[Bili]

If Giulia crossover means Giulia Sportwagon/Crosswagon I'm all for it. Bring it together with Giulia's "2nd generation" which is a big facelift + electric options technically.
I'm also happy for more offerings in the compact segments, maybe a Mito successor. But I can't imagine a good sports car on STLA medium.
And they just need an E segment model for overseas. America, Middle East, Asia.

Crosswagon is not a body work type which can be successful outside of Europe and even in Europe it will have limited reach.

First idea was a liftback. Liftback can be marketed as sedan in US.
And with having liftback it's easy to make a classic wagon or even shooting brake.
This is odd decision from the new management. Not to mention that at this time Giulia will be already 9 years old.

 

[pennellotref]

If Giulia crossover means Giulia Sportwagon/Crosswagon I'm all for it. Bring it together with Giulia's "2nd generation" which is a big facelift + electric options technically.
I'm also happy for more offerings in the compact segments, maybe a Mito successor. But I can't imagine a good sports car on STLA medium.
And they just need an E segment model for overseas. America, Middle East, Asia.

Actually regarding Giulia (and Stelvio), we're talking about a mild facelift. Nothing to be overly enthusiastic about sadly

 

[Bili]

Actually regarding Giulia (and Stelvio), we're talking about a mild facelift. Nothing to be overly enthusiastic about sadly

Watered down facelift in comparison to what was planned under FCA and pushed back by one year.

 

[TripleT]

Watered down facelift in comparison to what was planned under FCA and pushed back by one year.

Think how revolutionary the vehicles would have been if they had not had nearly 3 years of fiddle around on whether even to implement.. that alone was at least a year.

 

[AlexB]

Actually regarding Giulia (and Stelvio), we're talking about a mild facelift. Nothing to be overly enthusiastic about sadly

Watered down facelift in comparison to what was planned under FCA and pushed back by one year.

Think how revolutionary the vehicles would have been if they had not had nearly 3 years of fiddle around on whether even to implement.. that alone was at least a year.

Smells like Italian Infiniti

 

[Archknight]

Not all 5 are B or C segments. That's for sure.

We know what are the first two. Third is Giulietta.

But what are 4th and 5th?

But as I said none of them is a model which can be popular in US. For premium segment in US it's all about D and E segment, all about sedans and boxy looking SUVs. For example models like X4 and X6 from BMW are not particularly interesting for US public.

5th model is addition to Giulia and Stelvio, additional model. I can say that.

I hope you're right on a new Giulietta, it would be nice if the brand had a new gateway model.

 

[Deckard Cain]

Watered down facelift in comparison to what was planned under FCA and pushed back by one year.

Which is a shame. With a deep facelift they could pass it off as a new generation.
Much like VW did with the Golf V to Golf VI generations.

Maybe that Duetto will be a sporty Giulietta much like the Alfa Romeo GT was a sporty version of the 147. That might work.
But prioritizing that over E-segment models for the US market? It seems they're changing strategy and focusing Alfa solely in Europe again.

 

[pumadog]

I'll judge when it's more than rumors. The postponement of the MCA is obviously linked to the Tonale postponement. Makes sense IMHO to get some "whole new range" momentum.

If they planned to ignore the US market needs, why install a special US/America manager?

 

[cygnus]

Watered down facelift in comparison to what was planned under FCA and pushed back by one year.

I just hope it gets UConnect 5.

 

[Bili]

The original SOP order was:

1. 1.6 diesel
2. 1.3 PHEV
3. 1.5 P2.5 MHEV

After the latest changes it's:

1. 1.5 P2.5 MHEV
2. 1.3 PHEV
3. 1.6 diesel

This are the engines which will be available as MY22. I don't know what will change for MY23. Ex-FCA prepared a lot more for Tonale. I wouldn't be surprised if it's stopped by PSA in the name of CO2.

Power levels for the new 1.5 turbo are 130 and 160 HP. More powerful versions are in the works.
On the test bench this engines goes up to 300 HP without any issue.
Transmission is 7 speed Getrag wet DCT with built in electric motor.

PHEV will have 240 HP.

1.6 diesel is of course 130 HP version but here it will be mated exclusively to a DDCT or how Alfa is calling it TCT.

 

[pumadog]

I guess there's no manual option at all? Is there a 1.5 PHEV in the works as well?

 

[Mopar392]

The original SOP order was:

1. 1.6 diesel
2. 1.3 PHEV
3. 1.5 P2.5 MHEV

After the latest changes it's:

1. 1.5 P2.5 MHEV
2. 1.3 PHEV
3. 1.6 diesel

This are the engines which will be available as MY22. I don't know what will change for MY23. Ex-FCA prepared a lot more for Tonale. I wouldn't be surprised if it's stopped by PSA in the name of CO2.

Power levels for the new 1.5 turbo are 130 and 160 HP. More powerful versions are in the works.
On the test bench this engines goes up to 300 HP without any issue.
Transmission is 7 speed Getrag wet DCT with built in electric motor.

PHEV will have 240 HP.

1.6 diesel is of course 130 HP version but here it will be mated exclusively to a DDCT or how Alfa is calling it TCT.

Are these engine options for Europe only or also NA market and the rest of the world?

 

[Bili]

I guess there's no manual option at all? Is there a 1.5 PHEV in the works as well?

No.

Don't know nothing about 1.5 PHEV. PSA wants PHEV to die as soon as possible. Also they are too much obsessed with CO2 emission. Anything which could rise it is not welcome.

Are these engine options for Europe only or also NA market and the rest of the world?

Europe during calendar year 2022. Dunno about US. Maybe @redriderbob can comment on this topic.

 

[Deckard Cain]

The Tonale will have to be a model that fits into european emission restrictions. I doubt they will make US-centric engine options for a premium compact SUV that will probably sell less than 10.000 units per year in the US.

 

[Bili]

The Tonale will have to be a model that fits into european emission restrictions. I doubt they will make US-centric engine options for a premium compact SUV that will probably sell less than 10.000 units per year in the US.

There must be options. We are not living in communism.

All Tonale competitors are sold exclusively with a 2.0 T engines in US.

 

[Deckard Cain]

I don't disagree with you. Go tell that to the product developers.
I think that the Tonale/Hornet duo can have as much success as the Renegade/500X. With the Hornet more successful in the US while the Tonale would perform well in Europe.

A 2.0 GME version would make perfect sense IMO. Just like a Giulia and Stelvio 2.0 PHEV would've made.

 

[pumadog]

Maybe they offer some engine in the US only. And simply take it from the Hornet shelf. A Veloce/Q wouldn't hurt though.

 

[Bili]

Maybe they offer some engine in the US only. And simply take it from the Hornet shelf. A Veloce/Q wouldn't hurt though.

FCA for sure has tech in house to make a proper Veloce if not Q.

As we know 2.0 in non performance tune has as much as 330 HP. That's plenty for Veloce if you ask me.

But yet again. CO2!