Alfa Romeo Tonale mule caught on the road

[cygnus]

When do the CO2 credit payments to Tesla stop, officially?

 

[pumadog]

Looks like 2022 already.

Stellantis will künftig ohne Hilfe von Tesla CO2-Ziele erreichen

Stellantis, im Speziellen Fiat Chrysler, kommt künftig ohne die Hilfe von Tesla aus, um die eigenen CO2-Ziele zu erreichen. Teslas Gewinne trifft dies kaum.

www.elektroauto-news.net

 

[Bili]

Tonale looks more than ready for production start before the end of this year:

 

[pumadog]

Wow, so many! Looks almost like mass production already.

 

[Bili]

Tonale is not postponed because of production readiness. That's for sure.

 

[pumadog]

Pretty clear new spyshots here: 2023 Alfa Romeo Tonale spy shots: Electrified compact crossover coming soon



Light graphics close to the concept after all, but no hidden rear door handles.

 

[TripleT]

Its a Dudge hidden as a Alpha

 

[KrisW]

Pretty clear new spyshots here: 2023 Alfa Romeo Tonale spy shots: Electrified compact crossover coming soon


Light graphics close to the concept after all, but no hidden rear door handles.

Nice pictures, and the front-end is no longer much of a secret after seeing them, but the text accompanying them in that article is mostly wrong: It’s not based on the Compass; the PHEV will be 1.5 litres, not 1.3; and Tavares didn’t want higher performance from Tonale, but rather lower CO2 emissions. Part of the reason for this is that Stelvio/Giulia PHEV have been delayed (perhaps forever), so the task of meeting EU CO2 targets for the Alfa brand now falls entirely on Tonale and the future B-UV to be made at Tychy.

 

[Bili]

; the PHEV will be 1.5 litres, not 1.3; and Tavares didn’t want higher performance from Tonale, but rather lower CO2 emissions.

No. I don't know from where you got it.

 

[Bili]

Here is the thing and some of it are my guesses.

French came in and didn't like Tonale's production costs and engine list. Too much options, engines on the list and they had too much CO2 for their taste.

As the consequence engine list has been slashed. More powerful verions of the upcoming 1.5 turbo MHEV have been killed, same with the new generation od 2.0 diesel. 2.0 gasoline engine may live only for the US market.

In the name of CO2 Tonale's engine list in Europe will be:

• 1.6 diesel 130 HP
• 1.5 P2 MHEV 130-160 HP
• 1.3 eAWD PHEV 190-240 HP

Engine list like this actually mimics PSA C/compact segment offerings. where they offer 1.5 130 HP diesel, 1.2 3 cylinder gasoline with 110 and 130 HP with all more powerful being PHEVs, This is for C segment hatchbacks which were unveiled this year and they are FWD only in every form.

 

[pumadog]

This one seems to have different headlights: Alfa Romeo Tonale auf neuen Erlkönigbildern | Motor1.com Fotos



Provisionally like the rear lights or does the entry level have to do without the LED light graphics?

 

[Bili]

Entry level and optional offerings.

 

[pumadog]

According to this article more versions of the 1.5 Turbo are in the making: (M)HEV with 190 hp for Jeep, 215 hp for Alfa. Even up to 300 hp as PHEV for Alfa. Giulia and Stelvio should get it for MY23 (MCA).

 

[cygnus]

The 1.5 MHEV is going in the US Compass for MY23, I think.

 

[Mopar392]

I'd love to see the 1.5 Turbo PEHV.
It'd put Tonale on the same level as Audi SQ2 and VW T-Roc R but more efficient.

 

[Deckard Cain]

They need to comply with CO2 emissions so I don't pity niche engine options being discarded. It's more annoying that there's STILL no Giulia/Stelvio PHEV variants. They should've been launched even before the merger.
The Giulia is an expensive toy. As a commercial product, with the current engine range and no different body types it does not make any sense. The Stelvio is great but they need the PHEV versions.
The top selling midsize car in Europe in 2021 is the Tesla Model 3. That should be enough to point where the future of the segment lies.

 

[Bili]

They need to comply with CO2 emissions so I don't pity niche engine options being discarded.

Niche engine options are usually there because of brand imaging.

For example 2.0 with around 350 HP would do a lot for brand image, especially for Alfa Romeo. Offer it with mechanical AWD, add Focus RS like torque vectoring differential at the rear with classic LSD ar the front. It would be a winner.

 

[Bili]

According to this article more versions of the 1.5 Turbo are in the making: (M)HEV with 190 hp for Jeep, 215 hp for Alfa. Even up to 300 hp as PHEV for Alfa. Giulia and Stelvio should get it for MY23 (MCA).

That article is sort of mix of various information which could be found on the internet.

The truth is. 190 HP version was planned long ago and was planned as the first one. This was some 2 if not more years ago which means that in the final version engine could have 200 HP or more. This version of the engine.

But with PSA coming into play and CO2 is performance mantra a lot has changed. People who want more powerful engine options in Europe will be pushed towards PHEV and it's very unlikely that we will see 1.5 turbo MHEV with more than 160 HP.

 

[Deckard Cain]

Niche engine options are usually there because of brand imaging.

For example 2.0 with around 350 HP would do a lot for brand image, especially for Alfa Romeo. Offer it with mechanical AWD, add Focus RS like torque vectoring differential at the rear with classic LSD ar the front. It would be a winner.

Or maybe they should've released a PHEV with 350hp that would weigh less in emissions and have similar performance.

 

[Bili]

Or maybe they should've released a PHEV with 350hp that would weigh less in emissions and have similar performance.

First of all.

Performance oriented PHEVs can only offer modest CO2 reduction.

Why?

They have smaller battery capacity so that they would not add too much weight.

As we know more weight is counter productive for good handling.

And this is not something which is based on my opinion. I'm talking about Ferrari PHEV and Mercedes AMG PHEV powertrains which in both cases have roughly 7 kWh battery.